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Played a few hours of the mod in 4 test games. I think this is a vast improvement in general over CoH2 standard gameplay, which to be honest I never really liked. However, I thought I’d leave my 2 cents here… (I hope that’s the right forum). Bear in mind that while I am aware that the tools available to mod CoH2 are inferior to those of its predecessor, I don’t know the specifics of such limitations.
I was an alpha and beta tester for Normandy 44: European Theater mod, for CoH1, and to this day it’s still my favorite mod for a WW2 Strategy game. In a similar vein to this one, it was also a realism mod, but it had a different approach, one I hoped (perhaps erroneously) that the authors of this mod would also follow: That of both representing historical divisions as doctrines, and, more importantly, to really replicate the unforgiving nature of close encounters in WW2. What I mean by that is, for example, that 2 Panzerschreck HEAT rockets striking the rear of a T-34 don’t seem to kill it, where in reality one from the front was more often than not enough to at the very least disable it by killing multiple crew members. This applies to many weapons in the game, so while I think an astounding job was done regarding historical values for penetration and armor, damage is sorely lacking in multiple cases, thus preserving (unfortunately, IMHO) some of CoH’s arcadey gameplay. A similar point can also be made for the ridiculous (from a realism standpoint) restriction on targeting base sectors with bombers or long range artillery.
Furthermore, I think by incorporating historical doctrines and subdivisions it makes it somewhat easier to come up with varying shades of gameplay to fine tune your playstyle, and gives you plenty of ideas for strenghts and weaknesses (since all you have to do is analyze the actual formations, their composition, employment, wins, losses, etc.). N44 (if you din’t already know) also employed a system where the command unlock tree was subdivided to allow each doctrine to represent multiple formations, with fewer but more significant unlocks and modified buildings for each subtree. Bear in mind this is not a criticism per se, and more of a personal preference closer to my own heart, as I love to study the history of the different formations, its tactics, commanders, etc.
Last but not least, I want to thank you guys for taking the time and effort to make a realism mod for CoH2 come alive 🙂
Thoughts?
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Hi Khannis,
Firstly welcome to the forum and thanks for taking the time to post your thoughts.
I will try to address your questions where possible:
Historical divisions – we are already working towards this but it is a rework of doctrines that is not complete. You will notice in AEF and OKW (SS) factions the names are more accurate. British,Wehrmacht and Soviets are still to be completed. We haven’t always gone for a specific division especially on the German side as this mod covers both the eastern and western front from June 44 (Overlord/Bagration) through to the Battle for Berlin.
Mod Tools – the biggest issue we have when trying to create new doctrines and units is that COH2 does not currently allow you to add models. So many iconic units from WW2 are missing and simply cant be faked without ruining immersion. We also cannot change or add any infantry skins.
Damage – This is always a hot topic, this tank should “one shot” this tank etc etc. The reality is that a tank having a health bar is not realistic either so “damage” in COH is a very abstract gameplay mechanic which is fine, its an RTS game after all not a tank simulator. So what we have done to bring some realism to this mechanic is use historical mass to calculate hitpoints and have used shell HE filler weights and warhead type (APCBC, HEAT etc) to calculate damage. While this gives us a nice measurable way of implementing damage we realise that we cant please everyone with this method. So we have also added custom criticals on penetration to handheld AT and AT guns with more to be added to other weapons in the future. We also have a scaling damage system where as Tank crews vet up they inflict more damage (hitpoints) to reflect them aiming for more critical modules within the tank.
Targeting the Base – This is purely a gameplay decision. It is too easy to exploit, we have a fast growing PvP community and human nature wants to win at any cost! It is only “off-map” abilities that cant target the base, you still can use your on map models like howitzers and mobile artillery to destroy your enemies base.
Tech Tree – We are already doing more than any other mod (and vanilla) in this area with the help of some very dedicated and talented coders. Maybe in a distant future we could look at an even more complex tech tree but I think you’ll agree its already a massive improvement on the vanilla commander system.
NB: Only AEF and SS have their full non-linear tech trees completed.
I hope that has answered some of your questions and thanks again for posting. We are happy to accept feedback that is both positive and negative, it is the only way to improve.
I hope you will join us on our discord server where you will meet plenty of other Wikinger players for games and lively discussion!
Regards
MeatShieldNZ
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Thank you for your answers, MeatShield! I appreciate it 🙂
Historical divisions: I understand completely, as I said, it’s more a matter of style. I was just pointing out that going for specific divisions/formations (Kampfgruppen, mostly) instead of “themes” can be helpful for both accuracy and balance of playstyles.
Mod Tools: Well, that’s a real shame. It boggles my mind that CoH1 had a respectable set of tools, and they coudn’t manage even that same level of support for their sequel. I think the modding community is a HUGE reason plenty of their games had such a long life (the original Dawn of War being the prime example).
Damage: I understand that this is a hot topic, because the impact on balance and playstyle is HUGE. However, I don’t think that the (very) frequent one-shots that happen in N44 hindered the play style, on the contrary. But I understand that you cannot please everyone, and you guys seem to have a good plan, so I’ll trust it and keep following 🙂
Targeting the Base: I’ll freely admit that my only CoH multiplayer experience (in general) has been with friends, but as line of sight was both hard to come by and always necessary for such abilities, if a guy managed to sneak up that close to your base you are doing something wrong (plus the standard bunker/flakvierling/mg nest base defenses mowed down infantry). Lastly, you can always put it deeper in the Tech Tree, or have it cost more, but my philosophy with this things was always to try and adjust balance to allow realism, not the opposite.
All in all, you guys deserve plenty of praise for working on such an undertaking, especially with the challenges of CoH2.
Best Regards,
Khannis
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